2wd to 4wd conversion

[LANCE65]

It can't be all that bad. You can go for coils and have a much smoother ride or do leaf springs,your choice. Yes you need to make a X-member in front of the engine(clearance for the front axle),you 'CAN' box the frame or leave it alone,boxing it would be preferred. Now you can make the brackets to mount a GM Saginaw 2wd steering box to the front and go X-over steering. Make some radius arms and brackets and trac-bar for coils set-up or make a FRONT X-member with hangers and shackels for the rear fo the front leaf spring eye,and you have mounted your front axle. IT's ONLY METAL! I say go for it. Most people that say dont do it have never tackled something like this. Yes it can be a PITA,but once youre done you can stand back and say "I BUILT IT"

[eggman918]

"It's ONLY METAL "......you can cut it weld it grind it....oops weld it again grind it again.....finely file to fit.........and paint to match. I say go for it!
No guts no glory

[averagef250]

I could fill several of these pages with a list of the automotive and metalworking tools and machines in my shop and quite a few more pages with the machines friends have that I have access to. I have done one 2wd dent to 4x4 swap, actually, more accurately I undid and corrected the poor workmanship a PO had started. It was a large undertaking, far more complex and time consuming than a simple frame swap and I was paid my shop rate to do the work.

The only, single, sole reason this was a viable solution to the problem in my opinion was because the truck was a crewcab longbed F350. There was no such 4x4 made before 1980.

My answer to the questions "what does it really take", "How much more difficult can it really be than a body swap" and others along those lines is if you are asking this question you lack the necessary skills and knowledge to undertake it. If you are naive enough to underestimate the scope of stripping the front frame rails of your truck to a clean slate and starting from scratch as being only slightly more complex than a body swap you are going to have an enormous wake up call when you get into the project.

I'm a firm believer that nothing is impossible and almost anything that can be built can be unbuilt and copied or changed. What goes hand in hand with this however is the concept of just what all that can involve. If you don't know how front suspension and steering work, what forces act on motor mounts and how drivetrain angles interact with each other there's a 99% chance you will have put tons of effort into a paperweight in the end. There's also the 1% chance you will learn a whole lot and accomplish a nice truck in the end.

I make a living doing automotive work that lots of people say can't or shouldn't be done. If you're seriously considering doing this do your research first. This is a great website, but it does not come close to sufficing as adequate research for a project of this magnitude. Once you feel you have the scope of the project nailed down take a real look how hard it would actually be to buy a beater 4x4 here in the northwest where they're everywhere and ship or haul it to where you live. You can buy a complete 67-79 4x4 in these parts for 300-700 anyday of the week.

[eggman918]

I could fill several of these pages with a list of the automotive and metalworking tools and machines in my shop and quite a few more pages with the machines friends have that I have access to. I have done one 2wd dent to 4x4 swap, actually, more accurately I undid and corrected the poor workmanship a PO had started. It was a large undertaking, far more complex and time consuming than a simple frame swap and I was paid my shop rate to do the work.

The only, single, sole reason this was a viable solution to the problem in my opinion was because the truck was a crewcab longbed F350. There was no such 4x4 made before 1980.

My answer to the questions "what does it really take", "How much more difficult can it really be than a body swap" and others along those lines is if you are asking this question you lack the necessary skills and knowledge to undertake it. If you are naive enough to underestimate the scope of stripping the front frame rails of your truck to a clean slate and starting from scratch as being only slightly more complex than a body swap you are going to have an enormous wake up call when you get into the project.

I'm a firm believer that nothing is impossible and almost anything that can be built can be unbuilt and copied or changed. What goes hand in hand with this however is the concept of just what all that can involve. If you don't know how front suspension and steering work, what forces act on motor mounts and how drivetrain angles interact with each other there's a 99% chance you will have put tons of effort into a paperweight in the end. There's also the 1% chance you will learn a whole lot and accomplish a nice truck in the end.

I make a living doing automotive work that lots of people say can't or shouldn't be done. If you're seriously considering doing this do your research first. This is a great website, but it does not come close to sufficing as adequate research for a project of this magnitude. Once you feel you have the scope of the project nailed down take a real look how hard it would actually be to buy a beater 4x4 here in the northwest where they're everywhere and ship or haul it to where you live. You can buy a complete 67-79 4x4 in these parts for 300-700 anyday of the week.

I think your point is well made. As a machinist in industrial repair and auto mechanic as hobby,a project of this magnitude is possible but maybe not logical/cost effective.that doesn't mean you shouldn't do it,I am guilty of similar projects But AvrageF250 is accurate in his assessment of the level of difficulty but some people like the challenge,he's also right about the importance of RESEARCH it's like money in the bank.Take your time it's supposed to be fun

[AustinTom]

Check this 78 out appears to be a 4x4 conversion. Not a typical one though. Its a little ways down the page

http://race-dezert.com/forum/showthread ... 16&page=29

[1971ford]

I forgot about that build! A little different than what we are talking about though.

[OldRedFord]

I think this can be undertaken. One of the hard parts I foresee is getting everything lined up right and the axle squared to the frame. Thats what would keep me from doing this, unless I had someone that knew a bit about suspension work and such. I think you can do this and get some of the more experienced guys you race with involved. Ask them what they think and get guidance from them.

Good research, and good planing will yield a good project.

[1971ford]

I think this can be undertaken. One of the hard parts I foresee is getting everything lined up right and the axle squared to the frame. Thats what would keep me from doing this, unless I had someone that knew a bit about suspension work and such. I think you can do this and get some of the more experienced guys you race with involved. Ask them what they think and get guidance from them.

Good research, and good planing will yield a good project.

True about lining up the axle. But i think as long as you measure a stock bump 4x4 like what you are trying to make ,you should be ok. As in if you measure the frame to spring distance, on each side and get it just right, i don't see any problems. But i see what you are saying it would have to be pretty precise.

I'm going to look into putting TTB on a bump, im going to take some measurements on my brothers bronco, and F250 TTB's at the junkyard. Just wonderin how it would go into my bump

[eggman918]

I think this can be undertaken. One of the hard parts I foresee is getting everything lined up right and the axle squared to the frame. Thats what would keep me from doing this, unless I had someone that knew a bit about suspension work and such. I think you can do this and get some of the more experienced guys you race with involved. Ask them what they think and get guidance from them.

Good research, and good planing will yield a good project.

True about lining up the axle. But i think as long as you measure a stock bump 4x4 like what you are trying to make ,you should be ok. As in if you measure the frame to spring distance, on each side and get it just right, i don't see any problems. But i see what you are saying it would have to be pretty precise.

I'm going to look into putting TTB on a bump, im going to take some measurements on my brothers bronco, and F250 TTB's at the junkyard. Just wonderin how it would go into my bump

measure in an X right rear to left front left rear to right front. use leaf spring bolts that position the axles as reference point, this worked for us.we put camaro front clip on '59 chevy truck it drives true tracks straight

[Redcap]

I think this can be undertaken. One of the hard parts I foresee is getting everything lined up right and the axle squared to the frame. Thats what would keep me from doing this, unless I had someone that knew a bit about suspension work and such. I think you can do this and get some of the more experienced guys you race with involved. Ask them what they think and get guidance from them.

Good research, and good planing will yield a good project.

True about lining up the axle. But i think as long as you measure a stock bump 4x4 like what you are trying to make ,you should be ok. As in if you measure the frame to spring distance, on each side and get it just right, i don't see any problems. But i see what you are saying it would have to be pretty precise.

I'm going to look into putting TTB on a bump, im going to take some measurements on my brothers bronco, and F250 TTB's at the junkyard. Just wonderin how it would go into my bump

[1971ford]

I think this can be undertaken. One of the hard parts I foresee is getting everything lined up right and the axle squared to the frame. Thats what would keep me from doing this, unless I had someone that knew a bit about suspension work and such. I think you can do this and get some of the more experienced guys you race with involved. Ask them what they think and get guidance from them.

Good research, and good planing will yield a good project.

True about lining up the axle. But i think as long as you measure a stock bump 4x4 like what you are trying to make ,you should be ok. As in if you measure the frame to spring distance, on each side and get it just right, i don't see any problems. But i see what you are saying it would have to be pretty precise.

I'm going to look into putting TTB on a bump, im going to take some measurements on my brothers bronco, and F250 TTB's at the junkyard. Just wonderin how it would go into my bump

Why?
The chances of me actually doing a TTB swap are about .01%. I would much rather run a solid axle, i'm just curious how "easy" it would swap in compared to a solid axle. Just curious...
For a prerunner type build, not crawler, a well built, cut and turned TTB setup would be different.

[jdf]

i think that you can take a 78 or 79 dana 44 half ton coil spring front end radius arm, springs and all bolt it right under a 2 wd frame . the coil springs should line right up . drill your frame for the 78 4x4 radius arm brackets. if you have any lift at all i think the pumpkin will clear the 2 wd cross member by plenty of room . the stock 78 or 79 4x4 coil buckets are acually taller than the 4x2 ones so when you bolt the 4x4 springs to the 4x2 frame this should give you a 3 or 4 inch lift automatically .and your track bar should be simple to find a place to mount it . the only other issue is the steering . box the frame where you plan on mounting the steering put crush sleeves in between your box . use a 78 or 79 4x4 half ton steering box . everything should work great . this is what i plan on doing with my half ton 2wd to convert it to a 4wd .any input ?????????????

[averagef250]

i think that you can take a 78 or 79 dana 44 half ton coil spring front end radius arm, springs and all bolt it right under a 2 wd frame . the coil springs should line right up . drill your frame for the 78 4x4 radius arm brackets. if you have any lift at all i think the pumpkin will clear the 2 wd cross member by plenty of room . the stock 78 or 79 4x4 coil buckets are acually taller than the 4x2 ones so when you bolt the 4x4 springs to the 4x2 frame this should give you a 3 or 4 inch lift automatically .and your track bar should be simple to find a place to mount it . the only other issue is the steering . box the frame where you plan on mounting the steering put crush sleeves in between your box . use a 78 or 79 4x4 half ton steering box . everything should work great . this is what i plan on doing with my half ton 2wd to convert it to a 4wd .any input ?????????????

My input to your post is instead of using the word "should" and the phrase "I think" replace the effort used to type all this out with the effort to use a tape measure and actually figure it out. What you'll find is the tape measure method is 100 times more difficult than talking about doing it and you will run into more issues than you suspect.

Another way to phrase what you just wrote is: All I have to do is pull the 2wd engine/transmission from my 2wd ford, remove the front suspension, riveted radius arm mounts and steering, find or build the appropriate 4x4 steering column-firewall mounting plate, buy or build a steering shaft, buy a f100 4x4 steering box, reinforce the frame for the new steering box mount, realize the 2wd front frame sections are far flimsier than the 4x4 ones since they were never intended to mount a steering box and end up stripping out the 2wd front crossmember to box the frame rails and add an adequately rigid crossmember, build new engine mounts, buy 4x4 headers or keep manifolds and redo entire exhaust system, buy a rear sump oil pan and pickup for engine and gaskets and install it, buy a 4x4 transmission and transfer case, build a tranny crossmember, buy or build both front and rear drivelines, buy or build a transfer case shifter, buy a new speedo cable and finally you can get to doing all that other easy stuff you were talking about doing.

You're right. Much easier than doing a body swap.

[eggman918]

i think that you can take a 78 or 79 dana 44 half ton coil spring front end radius arm, springs and all bolt it right under a 2 wd frame . the coil springs should line right up . drill your frame for the 78 4x4 radius arm brackets. if you have any lift at all i think the pumpkin will clear the 2 wd cross member by plenty of room . the stock 78 or 79 4x4 coil buckets are acually taller than the 4x2 ones so when you bolt the 4x4 springs to the 4x2 frame this should give you a 3 or 4 inch lift automatically .and your track bar should be simple to find a place to mount it . the only other issue is the steering . box the frame where you plan on mounting the steering put crush sleeves in between your box . use a 78 or 79 4x4 half ton steering box . everything should work great . this is what i plan on doing with my half ton 2wd to convert it to a 4wd .any input ?????????????

My input to your post is instead of using the word "should" and the phrase "I think" replace the effort used to type all this out with the effort to use a tape measure and actually figure it out. What you'll find is the tape measure method is 100 times more difficult than talking about doing it and you will run into more issues than you suspect.

Another way to phrase what you just wrote is: All I have to do is pull the 2wd engine/transmission from my 2wd ford, remove the front suspension, riveted radius arm mounts and steering, find or build the appropriate 4x4 steering column-firewall mounting plate, buy or build a steering shaft, buy a f100 4x4 steering box, reinforce the frame for the new steering box mount, realize the 2wd front frame sections are far flimsier than the 4x4 ones since they were never intended to mount a steering box and end up stripping out the 2wd front crossmember to box the frame rails and add an adequately rigid crossmember, build new engine mounts, buy 4x4 headers or keep manifolds and redo entire exhaust system, buy a rear sump oil pan and pickup for engine and gaskets and install it, buy a 4x4 transmission and transfer case, build a tranny crossmember, buy or build both front and rear drivelines, buy or build a transfer case shifter, buy a new speedo cable and finally you can get to doing all that other easy stuff you were talking about doing.
Wow have you done a 4x4 conversion,that list is impressive and believable...I could hear/feel the frustration.It would be a hell of a job,only a last resort I guess.
You're right. Much easier than doing a body swap.

[Redcap]

i think that you can take a 78 or 79 dana 44 half ton coil spring front end radius arm, springs and all bolt it right under a 2 wd frame . the coil springs should line right up . drill your frame for the 78 4x4 radius arm brackets. if you have any lift at all i think the pumpkin will clear the 2 wd cross member by plenty of room . the stock 78 or 79 4x4 coil buckets are acually taller than the 4x2 ones so when you bolt the 4x4 springs to the 4x2 frame this should give you a 3 or 4 inch lift automatically .and your track bar should be simple to find a place to mount it . the only other issue is the steering . box the frame where you plan on mounting the steering put crush sleeves in between your box . use a 78 or 79 4x4 half ton steering box . everything should work great . this is what i plan on doing with my half ton 2wd to convert it to a 4wd .any input ?????????????

My input to your post is instead of using the word "should" and the phrase "I think" replace the effort used to type all this out with the effort to use a tape measure and actually figure it out. What you'll find is the tape measure method is 100 times more difficult than talking about doing it and you will run into more issues than you suspect.

Another way to phrase what you just wrote is: All I have to do is pull the 2wd engine/transmission from my 2wd ford, remove the front suspension, riveted radius arm mounts and steering, find or build the appropriate 4x4 steering column-firewall mounting plate, buy or build a steering shaft, buy a f100 4x4 steering box, reinforce the frame for the new steering box mount, realize the 2wd front frame sections are far flimsier than the 4x4 ones since they were never intended to mount a steering box and end up stripping out the 2wd front crossmember to box the frame rails and add an adequately rigid crossmember, build new engine mounts, buy 4x4 headers or keep manifolds and redo entire exhaust system, buy a rear sump oil pan and pickup for engine and gaskets and install it, buy a 4x4 transmission and transfer case, build a tranny crossmember, buy or build both front and rear drivelines, buy or build a transfer case shifter, buy a new speedo cable and finally you can get to doing all that other easy stuff you were talking about doing.

You're right. Much easier than doing a body swap.