'68 F-100 4x4 Disk Brake conversion

[JoshT]

Seen plenty about converting a 2wd but not so much about 4wd. Maybe I'm just searching wrong, but here goes...

Dad's got a 68 F-100 4x4 parked behind his house that I want to start fixing up one day in the not too distant future. One of the biggest complaints he ever had about the truck was the in adequate brakes any time he was towing something. The truck already has power brakes and dad went through the system a few times over the years, but still disappointing breaking performance. It may not be the first thing I tackle when I start on the truck, but it will be getting a front disk brake conversion.

Are there any disk brake conversion options to use all Ford components on a kingpin Dana 44?

I've found how to convert using Chevy components which I really don't want to do. I've found conversion kits, which are probably about the same parts as the Chevy conversion. I'd like to stay away from aftermarket to keep local parts availability for repairs. I have seen how to do this with all ford parts on a ball joint Dana 44, but no luck finding anything for the kingpin axles.

If it's a no go on the all Ford parts conversion I'll look into swapping the axle out for a later model, but I'd prefer to convert what I have than try to scrounge up an axle.

[ultraranger]

Front disc brakes weren't available on the Ford 4WD trucks until 1976. Get a front axle assembly and brake valve from a '76-'79 F100/F150 4x4 and swap them over.

[Busboy]

I'll never understand this!
Drum brakes work perfectly satisfactorily if in good condition. To me it isn't worth all this hassle. I do think some folks just love to modify and change stuff for the sake of change.

[cep62]

I'll never understand this!
Drum brakes work perfectly satisfactorily if in good condition. To me it isn't worth all this hassle. I do think some folks just love to modify and change stuff for the sake of change.

Have you ever pulled a heavy trailer in wet weather ?
I think it's worth the hassle.

Also the "78-"79 have a better tie rod set up than "76-"77.

[Madman]

I'll never understand this!
Drum brakes work perfectly satisfactorily if in good condition. To me it isn't worth all this hassle. I do think some folks just love to modify and change stuff for the sake of change.

Have you ever pulled a heavy trailer in wet weather ?
I think it's worth the hassle.

Also the "78-"79 have a better tie rod set up than "76-"77.

Disc brakes are superior in stopping power and ease of maintenance, which is why you no longer see drum brakes on modern vehicles

[JoshT]

Thanks for the feedback guys!

Front disc brakes weren't available on the Ford 4WD trucks until 1976. Get a front axle assembly and brake valve from a '76-'79 F100/F150 4x4 and swap them over.

That's what I was leaning towards. In my area I'll probably have to watch for a whole donor vehicle, but that might not be a bad thing as there are other parts I'd like from a later model if I find the right one. I'd like to switch out to a two speed transfer case which means I need to find a NP435/NP205 combo which could likely be found in the same vehicle. Also wouldn't mind swapping in wider rear axle (I know perches have to be moved). I don't normally notice it on a 2wd, but on a 4wd the narrow track width on the rear has always looked a little funny to me.

Also the "78-"79 have a better tie rod set up than "76-"77.

I'll put 78-79 at the top of my watch list for donors.

I'll never understand this!
Drum brakes work perfectly satisfactorily if in good condition. To me it isn't worth all this hassle. I do think some folks just love to modify and change stuff for the sake of change.

IMO in braking "satisfactory" is border line failing, I am looking for "exceeds expectations". Those people may like to modify and change stuff just for the sake of doing it, I like to modify and change things for the sake of making them better suit my needs/wants.

While it won't be a daily driver, I will be using the truck in traffic regularly and with the idiots out there satisfactory isn't good enough. I will occasionally be using the truck to pull a camper, a tractor, or a car on flat bed trailer. While I will have trailer brakes, satisfactory brakes on the truck still aren't good enough. Disk brakes are both more capable and easier to maintain, both of which make them better suited to my needs and wants.

If it's originality you are worried about, don't. It's no closer to original now than it was when it came into my family 30 years ago. I'll be going back towards stock in appearance, but suspension lift and oversized tires are staying. I'd also like to find a way to tuck the winch behind the grill with a stock front bumper. Probably going to get later model 16" aluminum wheels for appearance and tire availability. In addition to the brakes I'll eventually be adding a bolt on EFI system, aftermarket AC and a receiver hitch. I'll be relocating fuel tank to under bed and someday I plan to add overdrive, just not sure how I want to do it. Eventually I'll need to do an engine rebuild and who knows where that will end up, but it will stay FE based. I don't care about originality and it'll never be a show truck, I just hope to end up with a nice looking truck that suits my purposes.

[JoshT]

Disc brakes are superior in stopping power and ease of maintenance, which is why you no longer see drum brakes on modern vehicles

Which is great, except that I much prefer the looks and styling of classic vehicles. Newest truck I'd consider buying is a 96 F series.

Locally that body style F-150 with a 351 and 4wd will cost ~$5000 if it's in any decent physical shape, then probably another couple thousand to bring it up to par mechanically. That would easily get the 68 back onto the road with brake upgrades, full suspension rebuild, wheels, tires, and EFI. If I shop around enough it might even cover installing an AC.

[cep62]

I don't care about originality and it'll never be a show truck, I just hope to end up with a nice looking truck that suits my purposes.

Amen , brother.

[ultraranger]

No question that going from manual all-wheel drums to front discs and power brakes made a huge difference (for the better) on my '69 F100 2WD. --Before I had front discs and power brakes, I had power 4-wheel drums. Before that, I just had manual 4-wheel drums.

Possibly those that proclaim drums are just as good or, are adequate, have never swapped in a disc brake front suspension to experience what the difference really is. If they had, I highly suspect they would be recommending something else besides keeping the drums.

[JoshT]

I swear I didn't mean to start a (fairly one sided) drum vs disk war. Busboy is welcome to do what ever he wants to with his truck, with the exception of dropping in a Chevy/Dodge/etc. engine ( )or utterly destroying it, he'll never catch flack from me about it. I personally would never discourage someone from doing a front disk brake swap if they want to, but I'm also not going to push them into it unless there are other reasons for it. I would lay out the option if someone wanted better braking and try to help them to figure out best method if I can, but it's up to them if they want to do it.

This disk brake swap is (IMO) rather tame compared to my current project truck, a 1986 Ford Ranger 2wd. I firmly believe in adding more whoa before adding more go and it's getting a 5.0L V8 from a 98 Explorer in place of the worn out 2.9L. The truck came stock with a 10" rotor and single piston slide pin caliper up front, and little 9" drums out back. It's still TIB suspension, but acquired a conversion kit that will allow me to run 13" front disks and dual piston calipers from a 03-04 Mustang Cobra/Mach1 or any aftermarket BBK for same vehicle. In the rear it's getting the 31 spline 8.8" with disks from the Explorer. Biggest draw back with this combo is that the front requires a 17" wheel minimum and the rear axle is about three inches wider than stock. Fortunately 17" Mustang wheels seem to have just the right backspace/offset to make the axle work in stock form and stock Mustang tire sizes (as well as popular upgrade sizes) seem like they will fit fine with my 3/5 suspension drop.

I'd never push the same on someone else with a similar truck, but I will let them know that it is an option and point them in the right driecting if theey decide to do it. That said I'd probably recommend a 12" Sport Trac brake conversion over the 13" cobra conversion. Parts are cheaper and easier to come by and for most it would still be overkill.

Back on topic.. I'm sure that I could probably I could play with master cylinder bore sizes and exotic brake shoe materials and eventually get the drums to a point that I would be okay with the performance, but I'd never completely trust them. If I'm going through that much work I'd rather just swap in disks and be done with it. If it's just bolting in a different axle, master cylinder and proportioning valve, this is going to be a much easier (and more sensible) conversion than the current project's upgrade.

[ultraranger]

I believe the same as you and I'm not looking to be a participant in a pissing contest of drums vs. discs. As you said, if someone thinks their drums are fine/adequate, more power to them. Also, as you said, you shouldn't discourage someone from swapping if they don't want drums.

If you've never changed a drum brake Bumpside to discs, you really have no perspective of what the benefit really is to understand the positive gain it nets. I've done this swap twice --once on my own '69 F100 and on a '72 F100 that belongs to a friend. It was a vast improvement over the front drums in both cases.

[cep62]

After all, there is a reason every manufacturer made disc brakes standard.

[MTM]

I agree that the discs are superior. The later front end supposedly gives a better turning radius being that they are open knuckle.

I have 4 power drums on my f100 4x4 and it will stay that way unless It has massive failure of the front axle. They really work great when set up correctly. That being said I do not tow with the truck, nor would I ever consider towing more than a small load. I would not tow with it if it had discs all around. F100 4x4s are great trucks, but they are half tons, and will never be even close to a 3/4 or 1 ton in braking ability. It's not about how it stops the first few times but how quickly you can get them hot and they begin to fade. I would not want to rely on brakes on the truck to slow a big load down, I would want trailer brakes that can slow the trailer and load without overworking the truck.

Just to throw fuel on the fire of the disc vs drum thing, there are examples of OEM cars going back to drums from discs. We own a 2001 suburban that has discs on the rear, and I am 5x more likely to switch them to drums from a Silverado than I am to put discs on my F100. The parking brake is drum that is inside the rotor hat, and is probably smaller than a Honda Goldwing drum. It works for about a month before you have to adjust it, and it only really holds the vehicle facing downhill. It does not stop any better than my dads Silverado with lowly drums. The discs need to be replaced 3x for every drum job on dads truck and he is harder on his brakes than I am on mine. In 2007 GM went back to drums on suburbans, and I believe that that is a good thing.

One downside that I see to 4 wheel drums is that if you submerge all 4 they don't work well until they dry out.