converiting to 4 wheel drive

[69CSF250]

Hello all I have a question about making a 69 Camper special 2 wd into a 4x4. does this have to be a frame and running gear swap or could i utilize my existing frame and add the components etc? I do have access to a 72 f250 4x4 parts truck that has had the front axle torched off Bummer but replacable if I have to go the frame swap route is there body spacing issues with the 69 body to 72 frame both are F250's I cant swear to it but I thought I saw a picture on this site of a 4 door that used to be 2wd and it looked like it had basically bolt on spring hangers for the front leaf springs... any ideas or info would be greatly appreciated

[Mohillbilly]

Since the 250 frame is stronger, and the bodies/ mounting are the same AFAIK, it seems easier to swap the body onto that frame rather than the running gear swap.

[69CSF250]

Thanks I was leaning towards the body swap just seemed to make the most sense and plus all the parts are there already. I will try to make a list of the parts that I pull off of the parts truck and post them here maybe I will have something usefull for anyone interested. I have to admit though the 72 parts truck is very rusted...

[averagef250]

Really depends on what you're after in the end. There are a ton more parts other than just the frame and axles that make a bumpside F-250 4x4 different from a 2wd. The 2wd body will bolt onto the F-250 4x4 after drilling the 4x4 rear cab mounts though. Off the top of my head, the core support, radiator, steering column, oil pan, FE oil filter adapter, firewall to tailight wiring, front bumper brackets, tunnel cover, shifter boots, rubber body mounts, and probably a whole lot more that I'm forgetting besides of coarse the frame, axles, brake lines, springs, etc, etc are very different.

If you are going to do the swap, don't start with the 2wd frame. Firstly the F250 2wd frame is considerably weaker than the 4x4 frame and secondly it's a huge amount of fabrication that you will need alot of skill and knowledge to complete and have a vehicle that's safe to drive on the road.

If you are shooting for an end result of having your 69 camper special be a great running, driving, tight old 4x4 with modern ammenities like power steering, brakes, handling, etc. My suggestion would be to use just the 72 F-250 4x4 frame, core support, springs and rear axle and buy a 76 or 77 junker F-250 4x4 for a few hundred bucks and swap in the disc brake 6CF HD 44 front axle, power assist steering, 205 t-case and the complete brake system from booster, lines, brackets and hoses.

All the parts will be 100% bolt on from a 76-77 truck to the 72 frame (couple minor holes for power assist line brackets) and the time to do it is when you have the F-250 4x4 frame bare before it goes under the truck.

Good luck with it.

[Doug Comer]

I probably should know this. W hat is the difference in the core support? I've done a body swap a couple years ago on my f250 4x4 and don't remember that being an issue. Thanks in advance for refreshing my memory.Doug

[averagef250]

The 4x4's run a steeper drivetrain angle than the 2wd trucks to make the rear driveline U-joint angles acceptable whilst being 4" taller. With the engine sitting differently in the frame, the radiator is angled to match. The 4x4 core support is just the 2wd V8 core support with wings spot welded on either side of the radiator opening and a radiator with slightly different mounts. The 2wd core and radiator will work, but as I recall a shroud doesn't fit well.

The 4x4 core support is also used in 2wd trucks equipped with the factory super cooling option, atleast in the 73-79 trucks. Have yet to see a 67-72 that has factory super cooling, but I'm in Oregon, it rains 9 months of the year and overheating isn't much of a concern.

[Doug Comer]

That must be why when I tried to run a shroud it hit. Thanks Doug.

[72hiboy4x4]

averagef250, thats some good info.
I'm planning on putting a '68 2wd cab on my '72 4x4, and had not noticed the rear cab mounts difference.
one other thing, about the inner fenders, I am planning to use the 2wd versions. what are the differences there? My 4wd ones are toast.

[averagef250]

I've read that 4x4 and 2wd inner fenders are different for 67-72's, but honestly I can't see any difference myself. I believe my 70 F-250 4x4 is a pretty solid original survivor as far as the body is concerned. The inner fenders appear 100% identicle to 2wd stuff except for a strange bracket spot welded to the PS inner fender that I've never seen on another truck. I don't know what it's for. I have a suspicion that the 67-72 F100 4x4 uses a different DS inner fender as the steering box mounts outside the frame. I've not owned a 67-72 F100 4x4, but have owned some 73-79 F100 4x4's and the DS inner fender was different to clear the box.

I know it's not easy to find a perfect bumpside cab, but there are alot of differences between the 68-69 cabs and the 70-72 cabs. The wiring is completely different, gas tanks and mountings are different, cab trim is different and the rear hood bumpers aren't present on 70-72 trucks.

There is a locating hole that makes it real easy to drill the 4x4 rear cab mount holes. I just run a 1/4" drill all the way through, holesaw the top opening then drill the bottom hole to 1/2".

[Doug Comer]

I think the 2wd inner fenders are different but will work. Somebody correct me if I am wrong, the difference is where the dimples or bump for the shock towers are. I used 2wd inners on my f250 4x4 but also have a disc brake dana 60 up front (so I moved the shock towers anyway) and clearence was not a problem. Doug

[averagef250]

It is possible somebody replaced the inner fenders on my 70 in the 25 years it was around before I got it, but I know the fenders are original. I just took a long hard look at them and compared side by side with my only 2wd bumpside, they appear identicle. There's a cutout in the driver's side inner to clear the 2wd box and it's exactly the same on my f250 4x4.

I've also moved my shock brackets from thier original spots, but everything seams to clear fine. Even if the inner fenders are the same as 2wd and original to my truck it's not a 100% sure deal that other trucks don't have special 4x4 inners. My 70 was canadian built and special ordered with a ton of oddball options and add-ons and really isn't a good candidate to set the bar off of. It's a bit of an odd duck.

[69CSF250]

Thanks AvarageF250. Over the weekend I was at my brother inlaws farm and he has a 76 F250 that has all the parts that you mentioned. its just sitting there rusting away and I know it will be like pulling teeth to buy that from him but I will try... my end result would be to have a really nice 4x4 that would be reliable and function well. this is going to need some more thought before I dive into this....

[72hiboy4x4]

I know it's not easy to find a perfect bumpside cab, but there are alot of differences between the 68-69 cabs and the 70-72 cabs. The wiring is completely different, gas tanks and mountings are different, cab trim is different and the rear hood bumpers aren't present on 70-72 trucks.

There is a locating hole that makes it real easy to drill the 4x4 rear cab mount holes. I just run a 1/4" drill all the way through, holesaw the top opening then drill the bottom hole to 1/2".

Yea, I am aware of the wiring differences. Since my truck is a frankenstien anyways, that don't matter to me. I can take care of that.
All the cab trim is already off, and not going back on. The front end will probably be the '68 front clip, so the other stuff will match anyways. I might use a '72 grille again, but thats still up in the air.
Thanks for the info on the rear mount, I'll have to take care of that before I seal the floor.
Now if I can just find that $100 Dana 60 4:10, open knuckle, disc brake front end.........